[syndicate] Re: Mouchette website censored - public debate

Fri Oct 25 02:20:01 CEST 2002

Mr Tosic;

This is the second time you have called me a fascist on account of 
criticising art. I would encourage you to invest in your ability to 
discuss topics rather than applying instant reactions to the negative 
appraisal of an art work. I hold the opinion that Mouchette's art 
glamorizes sexual abuse- and I have stated in my email that I am more 
than willing to listen to anyone who disagrees.

You will note that I did not call for censorship, but merely that I do 
not believe that Mouchette is being censored.

Furthermore, I am disgusted by the constant resort of attacking opinions 
with barbaric personal asides. I am not a fascist. Any look at my 
comments or my world view or my art will tell you that I am the farthest 
thing imaginable from a fascist. I am a person with an interest in art, 
who has ideas of his own, and is willing to state them, and I have 
provided evidence in my email to make this statement clear to anyone who 
wants to look at it. Fascists do not post evidence and offer a 
willingness toward discussion and the hashing out of ideas, nor is the 
fascist ideology applicable to one who encourages, openly, the 
discussion of facts contrary to its own. I am asking for opinions and 
evidence that contradict my claim, and your response- that I am a 
fascist and that I need to leave the mailing lists you are on- is ill 
concieved and shows a peculiar understanding of fascism and open 
discussion of ideas.

Please be careful, Nikola. A Fascist is not simply a person who does not 
like the art that your friends make.

-e.

nikola tosic wrote:

> mr salvaggio
>
> sending this email to mailing lists shows that u think im interested 
> in ur fascist opinions
>
> well im not
>
> please do not post on syndicate and rhizome anymore
>
> thank you
>
>
>
>
>
> At 04:46 PM 10/24/02 -0400, Eryk Salvaggio wrote:
>
>> Hi Anna, I have some massive issues with Mouchette's art. On top of 
>> lacking any real insights, having horrible aesthetics and my problems 
>> with Mouchettes rampant careerism, I also have issues with art that I 
>> feel glamorizes self destruction, sexual abuse and death.
>>
>> You'd have thought people would have had enough of false 
>> presentations of death and self destruction by now since it was so 
>> connected to the early 90's bubble of security, when western 
>> societies were desperate for an opportunity to fetishize these things 
>> because it gave them a chance to break up the monotony of comfort. 
>> For now, anyone that enjoys the tongue in cheek sexualizations of 13 
>> year old girls [for example, 
>> <http://www.mouchette.org/touch/plush.html>http://www.mouchette.org/touch/plush.html 
>> ] might simply read the news for their titillation, where 
>> Fundamentalist regimes crank out Mouchette-like "art" such as court 
>> ordered gang rape on a mass scale. I think this is the type of art 
>> that ought to be ignored. I find very little evidence that Mouchette 
>> is exploring anything except for the territory of sexualization in 
>> this piece, either, nor do I find any explicit or implied 
>> condemnation of the practice. This is even more interesting if the 
>> rumor that Mouchette is a 45 year old man are true. I'm as sexually 
>> liberated as your next descendant of puritanical New Englanders, so I 
>> don't think I am being close minded about this, but I can't find any 
>> value in this work outside of the sexualization of 13 year olds. [ 
>> <http://mouchette.org/music/index.html>http://mouchette.org/music/index.html 
>> is another example, where Mouchette- allegedly a 13 year old girl, 
>> remember- "whimpers" or "moans" depending on your interactions.] 
>> Since no one seems repulsed by this art, I assume maybe I am just too 
>> stupid to have picked up on something of value? If anyone can tell me 
>> why, I am open to it. My assumption, however, is that people are 
>> simply too busy reading resumes. I might write a more full blown 
>> "article" on how Mouchette is simply soft-core child pornography, and 
>> I'd like to hear opposing viewpoints.
>>
>> Censorship I don't like either, but I have no reason to believe in 
>> this claim, when it is coming from an "artist" who fakes his/her 
>> identity, makes false accusations against other artists in public, 
>> etc. Why should I believe it, when I know for a fact that it has lied 
>> about things in the past for the sake of "rallying support" for its 
>> career? [the drivedrive "I hate Mouchette" hoaxes, for example- 
>> which, ironically enough, was a cover for her to try to trademark her 
>> own name, so that "detractors" (which were generated by mouchette 
>> itself) could be stopped.] If you try to access it now, it reloads 
>> automatically to the alleged cease and desist letter. It's the only 
>> page that does that on the whole site besides the piece in question. 
>> Why would that be?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -e.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> anna balint wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> would censors care about her suicide?
>>> there must be someting wrong with the suicide as well,
>>> since mouchette is an artist in residence presently at
>>> Franklin Furnace, NY.
>>>
>>> greetings,
>>> ab
>>>
>>>
>>> 24.10.2002 21:32:29, Eryk Salvaggio 
>>> <mailto:eryk at maine.rr.com><eryk at maine.rr.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  Date:   Thu, 24 Oct 2002 15:32:29 -0400
>>>>
>>>>  From:   Eryk Salvaggio <mailto:eryk at maine.rr.com><eryk at maine.rr.com>
>>>>  To:     <mailto:epistolaris at freemail.hu>epistolaris at freemail.hu
>>>>  Cc:     <mailto:syndicate at anart.no>syndicate at anart.no
>>>>  Subject:Re: [syndicate] Mouchette website censored - public debate
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  Didn't she kill herself yet?
>>>>
>>>>  -e.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  anna balint wrote:
>>>>
>>>>    Mouchette's website censored by copyright
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ;
>
> mailto:nikola at tosic.com
>
> http://www.tosic.com
> http://www.nekada.com
> http://www.njumedija.org
>
>
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